SJ Awards '11 Discussion

[eishiya]

Shadowblade: WRONG THREAD. Also, you HAVE to link to the comic, even if you post in the correct thread. If you do not, your nomination will be ignored.

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The chapter requirement has actually been removed, but Tezzle forgot to update the published rules. They've been updated now (at lest in the nomination thread?).
Also, comics shorter than 30 pages that are completely finished are, if I understood the committee chat correctly, allowed in the non-art-based categories. The rules do not make this clear.

[Shadowblade2584]

*Slaps Jimlad* MAKE MORE COMICS!

[JimLad]

It makes sense to me...maybe you could allow some give for a page that's like...double length, but it still doesn't say anything about how much time the artist put into making it.

True, but the same can be said about the number of pages, that's my point.
One person's page is another person's two pages. How can you draw the line when every comic is different, not all comics are chapter based either.
I can see why the rule is there though, to keep out new comics that don't yet have enough content to be considered an established comic. I think that can be done with minimum of 10 (non-filler) pages, then let the voting speak for itself. At 30 you're ruling out a lot of great comics that have been running for a while that just can't update that frequently.

That said I would be lying if I said I didn't raise this issue because it effects one of my comics, but there are also some others I can't nominate which are in the same boat. They are great comics that update once a week, which means unless they started some time before August last year, they're not eligible.

[eishiya]

We actually raised the required page count from 25 to 30, but we've also decided to allow shorter but finished comics in this year.

The idea is basically that we want there something to read. 30 pages is generally enough for a story to get into swing, or at least provide a fairly good idea of what to expect. For gag-a-days, this isn't needed, but for them, 30 strips is usually a good size to explore several kinds of humour or story-telling and prove that they're not one-trick ponies.
30 pages is also a good page count to show either improvement in the art, or at least that it's not getting worse. Many comics start out looking great but the effort teeters out after 10-20 pages.
In general, we felt that 30 pages was a good page count for a comic to show off its strengths.

These great comics that are too short now can still compete next year! My comic was also too short last year so it didn't make the cut by a couple of pages, so I know where you're coming from. All that did for me was made me want to make sure I updated more by next year (this year)! And I wanted to work harder to make it as good as the winners. ...I failed, but I'm pretty sure I did improve.

There are a bunch of comics I wanted to nominate but could not because there are only 20-ish pages to them :/ Next year!

A year isn't a long time to wait when you're a comic artist. Just don't think about it, keep putting out good pages!

Also! There is still over a month left to nominate! In your case, that's probably enough time to get more pages made.

[YakkitySax]

I'm a bit curious, since my comic was nominated for Best Custom Layout. Is that allowed since it isn't based off the comic itself? (which would make it ineligible to be nominated due to my post count.)

I'm really flattered, though. I'm just curious since I don't want there to be problems later because of it.

[eishiya]

Oh crud. My nomination, I didn't look at the page count because I am a tard. I'm afraid it's not allowed, no. If you get 30 pages by the end of the nomination period it's fine, but if you don't, the nomination will not be counted.

[YakkitySax]

I think you want me dead. >:C

[eishiya]

I edited it.
The only one who'd die would be me.

[darkenergy]

It makes sense to me...maybe you could allow some give for a page that's like...double length, but it still doesn't say anything about how much time the artist put into making it.

True, but the same can be said about the number of pages, that's my point.
One person's page is another person's two pages. How can you draw the line when every comic is different, not all comics are chapter based either.
I can see why the rule is there though, to keep out new comics that don't yet have enough content to be considered an established comic. I think that can be done with minimum of 10 (non-filler) pages, then let the voting speak for itself. At 30 you're ruling out a lot of great comics that have been running for a while that just can't update that frequently.

That said I would be lying if I said I didn't raise this issue because it effects one of my comics, but there are also some others I can't nominate which are in the same boat. They are great comics that update once a week, which means unless they started some time before August last year, they're not eligible.

Yeah...although honestly I can't think of a better system. I'd rather see something the person has spent a lot of time on win, rather than something just starting off that might end up dropped within a year.


On another note, why aren't there any categories that emphasize the story side as much as the art, since comics are expected to hit both? Best plot/characters would be nice, I think, and take the art into account. (Personally, I would like to see lettering as a category. But that's mostly because one of my lifetime missions is to eradicate Comic Sans.)

[blankd]

On another note, why aren't there any categories that emphasize the story side as much as the art, since comics are expected to hit both? Best plot/characters would be nice, I think, and take the art into account. (Personally, I would like to see lettering as a category. But that's mostly because one of my lifetime missions is to eradicate Comic Sans.)

I believe that is what the genres are for, unless you mean overall or something?

[CottonCandyPants]

I nominate DeSTRESS (http://www.smackjeeves.com/comicprofile.php?id=79511) for Best Drama.
I nominate Knights-Errant(http://www.smackjeeves.com/comicprofile.php?id=80170) and DeSTRESS(http://www.smackjeeves.com/comicprofile.php?id=79511) for Best Characters.
I nominate Knights-Errant(http://www.smackjeeves.com/comicprofile.php?id=80170) for Best Colouring.

[eishiya]

CottonCandyPants: Wrong thread. Nominations here are not counted.

blankd, darkenergy: The Best Genre categories are judged primarily on story. Art is important in how it helps convey the story, so if the art is great but the story's crap, it won't be officially nominated. But if the art is bad and the story is great, it still has a good chance. However, the judgement rides heavily on that genre, so a fantasy romance where the fantasy setting isn't explored much is likely to lose a Best Fantasy nomination to something more focused on fantasy, even if the overall story is better. But it still doesn't hurt to nominate a comic for all the genres which have a significant presence in the story - you never know!
Best Characters is similar - characters are judged primarily how they are written, but their visual design also has some say.
Best Plot was not included as a category because it's redundant. The winners of the genre awards are expected to have good plots for their genre, and between genres, plots are very difficult to compare objectively.

[darkenergy]

blankd, darkenergy: The Best Genre categories are judged primarily on story. Art is important in how it helps convey the story, so if the art is great but the story's crap, it won't be officially nominated. But if the art is bad and the story is great, it still has a good chance. However, the judgement rides heavily on that genre, so a fantasy romance where the fantasy setting isn't explored much is likely to lose a Best Fantasy nomination to something more focused on fantasy, even if the overall story is better. But it still doesn't hurt to nominate a comic for all the genres which have a significant presence in the story - you never know!
Best Characters is similar - characters are judged primarily how they are written, but their visual design also has some say.
Best Plot was not included as a category because it's redundant. The winners of the genre awards are expected to have good plots for their genre, and between genres, plots are very difficult to compare objectively.

Gotcha. I thought the system was public voting, though? If it's not, some idea of criteria would be good.

What about best-told plot? The point being that I can't think of any other way to commend a solidly paced story.

[Gibson Twist]

Can someone explain why comics that won last year aren't eligible this year? And if possible, can someone explain it in a way that doesn't make it sound like this is just a giant little league baseball game where everyone gets to play? If Mokepon is the best fancomic on the site every year, which it is, shouldn't it deserve to be recognized for being the best every year?

[tezzle]

Can someone explain why comics that won last year aren't eligible this year? And if possible, can someone explain it in a way that doesn't make it sound like this is just a giant little league baseball game where everyone gets to play? If Mokepon is the best fancomic on the site every year, which it is, shouldn't it deserve to be recognized for being the best every year?

Because the awards set-up is really just a means of advertisement. We want to get the names of as many deserving comics out there as we can, and if we keep listing the same ones every year it defeats the purpose. It IS a giant little league baseball game where everyone gets to play. Most of the people on this site are webcomicking for a hobby, so I don't find it fair to objectively judge the site for quality. If anyone on here wants to actually make it as a webcomicker they need to expand their horizon beyond SJ.